OneMedicine Podcast

Rob Lutz 00:02
Hello and welcome to the OneMedicine Podcast with Today's Practitioner. In each episode, we share the expertise of a respected thought leader. Some you'll know and others you'll probably meet for the first time. We cover topics important to you, always with a focus on improving the health outcomes of the patients you treat, while expanding your understanding of the many healing modalities being used today.

Rob Lutz 00:24
Hello and welcome to this episode of the OneMedicine Podcast. I'm Rob Lutz, your host. Our guest today is Dr. Andrew Campbell, and we will be discussing the brain in children and adults, effects of toxic molds, and their mycotoxins. It's a pleasure to have you on the show again, Dr. Campbell, and I will include a few links to the previous episode, which is was our highest number of downloads of any episode we've ever done. So thank you for that, as well as some other content that you've provided. We've got some articles that you've authored. You also did a webinar, so there's a lot of great content around this topic, and we have a Mycotoxin Resource Center that holds a lot of this content. So I'll include those links in the show notes. But before we get started, would you mind just introducing yourself to those who don't know you yet? Share a little bit about yourself and any additional context around today's discussion.

Andrew Campbell 01:16
Okay. Medical doctor. I specialize in clinical immunology and toxicology. Published over 100 studies. I'm the editor-in-chief of various medical journals, and I've taught in various--lectured in various medical schools, et cetera, all over the United States, Canada, Mexico, and England, or the UK, as they call it over there. And basically in medicine, I was taught in medical school, "In God We Trust. Everyone else has to show the data." So, when I see all these websites and all these comments on social media--Doctor Facebook, Doctor Google, and all these others--and they contain so much misinformation, so basically, what I'm trying to do is help healthcare practitioners get the real stuff from published medical studies. And by doing that, I hope I'm serving them and the people that they see to get well and leave this behind them in their life and go on with their life instead of being sick all the time.

Rob Lutz 02:31
Yeah, and this is a topic, you know, as I said, it's been very popular, and I think that's for a reason. You know, one thing we talked about on the last episode is how prevalent mold is in the buildings in the world that we live in. You talked--went into some detail--about mycotoxins. We'll talk about that, but it seems to be an issue that you're hearing more and more about. And it sounds like, from what you've shared in the past, it has impact in ways that we would not necessarily anticipate with other diseases and conditions and things like that. So, to just get started, you know, what are mycotoxins and where do they come from?

Andrew Campbell 03:07
Sure. When there is moisture in an indoor environment--it doesn't have to be a lot. It just can be just a little bit of moisture, like what you feel on a windowsill after a big rain. That's enough to have mold start growing, and as they grow, the medical term is they sporulate. What that means in plain English is they make spores. And those spores carry mycotoxin, not the mold itself, the spores the mold makes.

Andrew Campbell 03:39
And human hair is 100 microns thick. Mold spores are two to four microns thick, so they are floating in the air in that person's workplace, home, in a car, garage, at the yoga class, at the gym, and they're being inhaled, and because they're so small, they go right into the deepest part of the lungs, called the alveoli. And from the alveoli, they transfer to the blood. Now it's been well-established for almost 40 years that the first place molds go to is the brain. So, remember, the brain is the most protected organ in the body. It's completely surrounded by skull. The heart isn't, the liver isn't, kidneys aren't, but the brain is. It weighs about three pounds, which is about 2% of body weight, yet consumes 20 to 30% of the calories we take in. It gets oxygen from the vertebral and carotid arteries. Those are the two first arteries that come out of the aorta, which means that they're the most oxygenated blood.

Rob Lutz 03:41
Mm hm.

Rob Lutz 04:53
Mm hm.

Andrew Campbell 04:56
System, and 20% of the oxygen absorbed by the lungs goes to the brain. So, and the circulation per hour, the blood flow, is 13 gallons per hour. So therefore, it's an important organ. There's approximately 400 miles of blood vessels in the brain. The great majority of them are capillaries, the size of--I mean, tiny. But remember, there's 100 billion cells in the brain, and each one needs to get both nutrients and oxygen, each cell. Otherwise, the cell dies. So that shows how important the brain is. It's also, if you, if we want to put it a little more philosophically, that's where all our thoughts, memories, emotions, actions, and reactions come from.

Andrew Campbell 05:52
So that's the importance of the brain, but this is the first place that gets attacked. So, one of the things that it does is it destroys myelin. Mycotoxins destroy myelin. We've heard how the brain is gray matter and white matter. Well, myelin is the white matter. It's the coating on all nerves, just like, you know, from your lamp to the plug in the wall, that wire is coated. Well, that happens in all the nerves in the body, including in the brain, and also in the rest of the body. And this eats away at that coating and destroys brain cells. How? Because mycotoxins are molecules; they're not living organisms. The molds are, and the spores are living organisms, but not toxins. Glyphosate, formaldehyde, mycotoxins are just molecules; they're not living things. So, as a molecule, it works at the molecular level. It goes into the cell of the brain, into the mitochondria, dysregulates the mitochondria. Then, the cell dies, and then it goes to the next one. So, what does it cause, besides all these things at the molecular and cellular level, what does that result in? Well, one of them is autism spectrum disorder, decrease in short- and long-term memory, both in children and adults. It can cause optic neuritis. People with blurred vision, they don't know why they keep going and getting their glasses changed, and it helps for a little while, but then it gets worse. There is a disorder known as chronic inflammatory demyelinating polyneuropathy.

Rob Lutz 05:55
Mm hm.

Rob Lutz 07:50
What is that?

Andrew Campbell 07:51
That's CIDP for short. That's a chronic removal of the myelin caused by inflammation, and it occurs in the arms and legs. So, this is neuropathy, meaning you get nerve damage and therefore nerve pain and loss of balance, and pain, as well as pain in the face. Mycotoxins are known to cause neurodegenerative disorders. These are Parkinson's, Alzheimer's disease, amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, and this is--so, from the beginning, as in childhood to old age, we're having effects of these mycotoxins. So, for example, there's a lot of misdiagnosis on them. The most common ones are chronic fatigue syndrome, fibromyalgia. Why? Because these folks are chronically fatigued with brain fog, aches and pains that they didn't have. They have short-term memory loss. They keep wanting to say--they can't remember the person's name, and it's right there in front of them, and they just can't get it. They have mood swings. They have anxiety and depression. There are several medical schools that now, in the Department of Psychiatry, when patients don't respond to medication, they do the mycotoxin testing and treat the mycotoxins, and the anxiety and depression goes away. These are people with depression that is resistant to antidepressant medication.

Rob Lutz 09:38
I've got a question. You just made me think of something. So, you know these mycotoxins, very small, get into the lowest part of your lung, get into your bloodstream. They go to your brain. How do they ever get out of your system? Right, if you don't do something about it, do they just build up over years and years and years for all the exposure you have from this place and that place? Do they?

Andrew Campbell 10:01
So, if you remember before key fobs came around, and everybody presses a button nowadays, we had keys on a keychain.

Rob Lutz 10:09
Right.

Andrew Campbell 10:10
Sometimes there were cute little things or interesting things or whatever. Well, imagine that with the molds, spores, and the mycotoxins. Okay, so it's like a key fob with a key on it. Well, if you kill the spore, you've gotten rid of the source of the mycotoxin.

Rob Lutz 10:35
Right.

Andrew Campbell 10:36
So the way to do it is to kill the spore.

Rob Lutz 10:38
Mm hm. But the spore's in my house, right? So?

Andrew Campbell 10:42
So, the spores are in your house. So, the first thing a person has to do, the very first, is get rid of the source. So, if you and I are working in a laboratory where there's mercury, and even though we get treatment for mercury poisoning, if we continue showing up every day at the lab and inhaling mercury fumes or whatever, we're never going to get well.

Rob Lutz 11:07
Yeah. ou're spinning your wheels.

Andrew Campbell 11:09
Exactly. So the first thing to do is you've got to get rid of that mold that's making the spores and the mycotoxins, and then you start treatment, not before,

Rob Lutz 11:21
Yeah. So, and I'll just kind of back up just a little bit. So, let's say your patient, you think they've had some mold exposure, but you're not sure. So, you want them to test for that. How do you test your patient? How do you do that? I know there's some different tests out there that can be done. What are your opinions on the different tests that are out there?

Andrew Campbell 11:43
So, if a doctor tests a patient for molds, that's going to tell them is that person, the two things: Are they allergic to molds? Or at one time, did they get infected by molds? Because there's--molds are infectious agents. They're part of microbiology, bacteria, viruses, parasites, and fungi, or molds--like an automobile and a car. So, molds are living organisms. There's medications to treat them. All of us have some molds on our body, especially where it's dark and moist, like armpits, et cetera. But they're kept in check by the immune system. Then, there's nuisance infections, like toenail or, you know, in between the toes, you get that area, and you've got to treat it, or what is called jock itch. It's really tinea cruris. All those are skin-type molds that you can use creams for, et cetera, and then eventually you get rid of. So mycotoxins--because they're molecules, and they're not easy to get rid of--so, the testing for molds is not that useful. Allergy, or you had an infection sometime in your life. Maybe it was in summer when you were in summer camp in your teenage years. You don't know. So the testing: there's two methods of testing. The one I use, because it's a validated test, is the blood serum testing, and that tells you two things: Are you currently being exposed? Or was it from old?

Rob Lutz 13:35
Mm hm.

Andrew Campbell 13:35
I'm sorry?

Rob Lutz 13:35
How can you tell the difference in that blood test?

Andrew Campbell 13:37
Okay.

Rob Lutz 13:38
Yeah.

Andrew Campbell 13:39
The blood test consists of IgG antibodies, immunoglobulin G antibodies to mycotoxins. That indicates if they're in your body at this time and how much of each. The IgE tells you, is it in your environment or not. How do you tell that? IgG takes 30 days to make an antibody, an IgG. It takes less than a day to make an IgE. So that tells you, "Okay, I'm going somewhere where I'm getting exposed to these toxic mold and their spores." So, but say the IgE is very low or non-existent. Well, that means that what's in you now is from some time in the past. It could have been an apartment you lived in three years ago or wherever. But if the IgE is high too, and the IgG is high too, that tells you, "Uh, oh. It's either at work or where I'm living." Could be your car, not in your car. Some people, you know, "I go to the gym three times a week. So, am I getting it from there?"

Rob Lutz 14:53
Right.

Andrew Campbell 14:53
Or yoga class. Maybe some people go to a yoga class, or you know, those kind of places.

Rob Lutz 14:59
Sure. Yeah.

Andrew Campbell 15:00
So you've got to become a Sherlock Holmes to figure out where it is, and that's the hardest part.

Rob Lutz 15:05
Yeah.

Andrew Campbell 15:06
Undoubtedly. Where is it?

Rob Lutz 15:08
Mm hm. And you've got to figure out where it is so you can limit your exposure or remove it completely, right?

Andrew Campbell 15:16
Correct.

Rob Lutz 15:16
Yeah.

Andrew Campbell 15:17
Correct.

Rob Lutz 15:18
Okay.

Andrew Campbell 15:18
And the other issue about mycotoxins in the brain--and it crosses the placental barrier. So, here are young mothers, and these things are getting into, through the placenta and affecting the fetus. And it can cause malformations--because we know they're mutagenic--miscarriages, stillbirth, early or late abortion, prematurity. 73% of amniotic fluid samples from babies with genetic defects had mycotoxins. Three-fourths, 73%.

Rob Lutz 15:59
Wow.

Andrew Campbell 16:00
So, you know, those mycotoxins can start even in the fetus, and then, you know, brain development affects all areas of an infant's growth. It includes when it's born, language, communication, movement, social, emotional, cognitive functions, et cetera. Well, these can all be affected by these toxins, and so, because children's brains are very vulnerable. Why? Because they don't have the capacity to break down toxins yet, like you and I as adults. So, all of these can lead to what are known as neurodevelopmental disorders: learning disabilities, behavioral abnormalities, and of course, autism spectrum disorder. And these, there's--for example, there was a study done on 172 autistic children with 60 controls, 60 children that didn't have autism, 172 with autism. This is from Tufts University School of Medicine up in Boston. Well, they checked them for mycotoxins. The autistic group had mycotoxins. The non-autistic children did not have any.

Rob Lutz 17:23
Hmm.

Andrew Campbell 17:23
So, they said that this implies that mycotoxin causes autism spectrum disorder. That's the implication the study showed, and that's significant. Now, there's other risks for autism that, you know, if you live near a highway, that's a risk factor. If there was, if there was any ingestion of certain metals--nickel, manganese, lead, mercury, so on and so forth--that can do it. Air pollution, especially if it has a lot of diesel particulates, those can also. It's not only mycotoxins. They're now saying in these studies, that's the number one thing to look for first. If it's negative, then you go look for the other ones.

Rob Lutz 18:15
So I just wonder if it's that--it seems like there's a pretty strong connection. Should mothers, before they get pregnant, test for mycotoxins and detox prior to trying to get pregnant?

Andrew Campbell 18:28
That is a great suggestion, but I have not read any studies that directly address that. And as you know, I have--I go by what is published.

Rob Lutz 18:39
Right.

Andrew Campbell 18:39
Otherwise, I'm just--it's an opinion.

Rob Lutz 18:41
Right.

Andrew Campbell 18:41
And everyone's got an opinion.

Rob Lutz 18:43
That's true. Yeah, it just seems like that might be something to consider, or at least to, you know.

Andrew Campbell 18:49
Also, the other thing to consider is exposure to glyphosate, and these--this is from the USDA. They have a graph showing they're parallel. This is autism spectrum disorder, and this is the use of glyphosate on crops.

Rob Lutz 19:07
Mm hm.

Andrew Campbell 19:08
So, you have to take that into consideration as well. I published an article a while back on glyphosate. Originally, it was developed to--you know, your water heater gets caked on the inside with minerals. It was meant to remove those minerals. And now we see that even if you use glyphosate on a piece of land once, five years later the soil--and never use it again--five years later, the soil still has glyphosate. So, that's also a risk factor I thought I'd mention. The other thing is that there's a particular mycotoxin called zearalenone, which is a highly estrogenic one, and it has an impact on little girls that causes precocious puberty. I once saw a young five-year-old girl who was menstruating.

Rob Lutz 20:04
Wow.

Andrew Campbell 20:04
And it's not unusual for them to develop puberty at age seven or eight, whereas you and I grew up thinking it'd be, you know, 12, 13, 14, more or less.

Rob Lutz 20:16
Right.

Andrew Campbell 20:17
They get it much earlier because of that particular mycotoxin. It also can cause polycystic ovary syndrome, endometriosis, things that can affect getting pregnant or maintaining the pregnancy. So, all these start way back in the womb, if you wish.

Rob Lutz 20:40
Yeah.

Andrew Campbell 20:41
Then the other effects on the brain is that it causes what is called brain fog. And this was a study published a while back by Dr. Empting in 2009. He says these psychiatric issues, which patients relate to as brain fog, that they're caused by mycotoxins. And then another study that came out in 2018 in the journal Clinical Therapeutics reported how these patients have increased levels of cognitive problems, physical problems, emotional problems, mostly depression. And you know, that one of the number one drugs prescribed in the United States in quantity is antidepressants and anti-anxiety pills.

Rob Lutz 21:33
Mm hm. Mm hm.

Andrew Campbell 21:33
Well, so now, I haven't read a study that says it's because of this, is that, connecting the two, but it's something that's out there that a person has to think of. So, the other part is that there's a study that was done at Rutgers University School of Medicine, and Rutgers looked at MS, which affects primarily young people. Well, to me, everybody's young, but you know, I'm talking about people in their 20s and 30s.

Rob Lutz 22:05
Yeah.

Andrew Campbell 22:06
And again, multiple sclerosis is a demyelinating disorder, and they linked it, the study linked it, directly to a mycotoxin known as gliotoxin. And they, the study was very--it caused a lot of excitement, because it says, "Maybe now we have something to really go on instead of just giving them something to kind of slow it down. No, we can get rid of it." And you can.

Rob Lutz 22:36
So that particular mycotoxin, is there a specific type of mold that it comes from? Or?

Andrew Campbell 22:43
No. One mold usually makes several different types of mycotoxins, and one mycotoxin can come from several different molds.

Rob Lutz 22:52
I see. Okay,

Andrew Campbell 22:53
So, we've got these studies showing that. We've also got studies. Doctor Tuuminen, Finland, the University of Helsinki, showed how these patients with what is known as POTS--P-O-T-S, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome--and myalgic encephalitis, chronic fatigue syndrome, fibromyalgia, chronic regional pain syndrome, all these were identified by her and her group of professors there as being caused from molds and mycotoxins. So the literature is clear. That was a study published a few years ago, but again, it's all going in that same direction. Now, there was another study done, and this was--and this study is actually used by the National Institutes of Health on their website on molds. They used, at the end there's 16 studies they list, and this is number 8. And this is a study published by a group of us. Dr. Vojdani and I, and several other doctors, Dr. Jack Thrasher, et cetera, got together. We studied 119 patients. 79 were women, 40 were males, and we used 20 controls. And we wanted to see from these mycotoxins, what kind of nerve damage is there? As we know, there's motor nerves, the ones that feed muscle to tell you move your arm, lift up, pick up, push, whatever, movement. And then there's sensory nerves, touch, pain, heat, et cetera. And then there are some nerves that are both. So, what we found is half of them had both the sensory and the motor neuropathy, and a quarter of them had motor and the other quarter, sensory.

Rob Lutz 24:57
Mm hm.

Andrew Campbell 24:57
This was shown by nerve conduction velocities. These nerve conduction velocities pick up demyelination at about 2 to 3%, so it's very sensitive study. And then one caveat: gliotoxin, the one that they studied for the multiple sclerosis patients, increases in toxicity if you increase the amount of glutathione you're taking, so do not take glutathione if you have gliotoxin.

Rob Lutz 25:33
Wow. What happens if you do?

Andrew Campbell 25:35
It makes the gliotoxin more toxic to the body, and it worsens all the symptoms. So, there was a doctor, a study published in Neurosciences, done by Dr. Ordog. He had a group of patients who were all employees, government employees, that worked in a building that had all kinds of water intrusion, leaks. You know, when it rained, they used to cover their computers and printers with plastic when they left for the weekend in case it rained. So, it was a--they were really--and they were complaining of memory loss, cognitive functions, dizziness, headaches, visual disturbance, numbness, weakness, tingling, and all these. So he decided to do an MRI on each one of these and a PET scan.

Rob Lutz 26:39
Mm hm.

Andrew Campbell 26:40
All of them had demyelination. So, that's a good journal, Neurosciences. Much later, not too long ago, there was a study done, autopsies, on patients with Alzheimer. So at autopsy, they looked at different regions of the brain--you know, the frontal cortex, in the front, the side, different parts of the brain, as well as the cerebrospinal fluid, and the blood vessels, the major blood vessels--all of them had fungi, molds.

Rob Lutz 27:17
Wow.

Andrew Campbell 27:18
So then, another center, a Euro lab, does autopsy studies on what is known as amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, which is ALS, Lou Gehrig's disease. Same for all parts of the brain, and then what happened was they found out--well, okay, so we know about Lou Gehrig's disease. We know about Alzheimer. What about Parkinson? Parkinson is also part of dementia. Well, they found that ochratoxin, a particular mycotoxin, can cause in patients Parkinson's disease. And then another study came out, The effects--and this was published, this came out of the University of, the medical school at Boston University. No, I'm sorry, out of Tufts, again out of Tufts--the effects on mycotoxins on neuropsychiatric and immune processes. And they found that in patients with ALS, 5 to 10% of Lou Gehrig's disease is genetically caused, can be caused by genetics. The rest, 90 to 95%, is due to mycotoxins.

Rob Lutz 28:41
I mean, this is actually, these--you don't hear enough about this, but these are all conditions that nobody wants to get. Right? And it's probably something that builds up over time because of exposure. And maybe yes, you're--some people are exposed to a high dose of mycotoxins in a short period of time, but these are probably things we're collecting over years and years and years, and eventually, enough damage gets done.

Andrew Campbell 29:04
I remember 25 years ago or so, a doctor came to see me with his wife and his autistic son, five years old. Very autistic, it was quite obvious. And you know, father's a doctor, mother works at the office with him, so I decided this is someone whose brain I can really pick, because we speak the same language. It'll make it a little bit easier. It turns out they got married, and she worked as office manager, and he was starting his practice. So, sometimes they went in, not only during--they were there during the week, but sometimes on Saturday it was catch up for the charts, catch up for the bills, or whatever. So they were there, and then the baby's born. Well, after a while, they start bringing the baby's crib with them for a couple hours on Saturday and during the week, sometimes too, et cetera. Then, he turns out autistic. So he, him being a doctor, was easy to get colleagues in the building where he worked to check him out: neurologists, pediatricians, et cetera. "Yeah, yeah. There's nothing we can do. Yeah, it's autism," you know, "All the best," et cetera, et cetera. Then he--something happened. One day, they were there on a Saturday, and by this time, the baby had grown enough so that he was put in one of those--what do you call them? Cages, that I call them, but you know--a playpen. And there's the playpen, and there's a knock on their door, and the doctor opens the door. It's these three guys in Tyvek suits, goggles, gloves, armbands, et cetera, and respirator. And they say, "We're here to check for molds." "There's no molds here. I don't see any molds." He says, "You don't understand. Two floors above you in this building, against this wall, there's a sink, and the pipe has been loose behind the wall, and it's been leaking down all through these floors." Well, that's the wall they set the playpen, the crib, all this. And that's when he read some of my studies and decided to come see me.

Rob Lutz 31:27
Mm hm.

Andrew Campbell 31:27
I said, "You just flew over 10,000 doctors?" He said, "Yeah, because the only thing that could make sense is molds and mycotoxins." Because they did find the mold. And they actually moved the office. They didn't want to be in there. Anyway, the point is, I said, "Look, I'm not---I'm going to do the test, but I'm not going to wait two weeks. You're a doctor. I can start treatment now. Here's my cell phone. Give me yours, so if there's anything, you can call me day or night and tell me what's going on. Because it may not be this."

Rob Lutz 32:03
Right.

Andrew Campbell 32:03
Two months later, I get a call from mom, and she says, "My son spoke to me for the first time."

Rob Lutz 32:11
Wow!

Andrew Campbell 32:11
And then six months later, eight months later, he went to school.

Rob Lutz 32:15
So it's for, you know, young children, if you catch this and treat it, they can improve. What about adults that have brain fog and are beginnings of Parkinson's and things like that? Are?

Andrew Campbell 32:29
So this young mother, 32, with three little girls, starts feeling poorly. She goes to her doctor. Her doctor sends her to a neurologist. The neurologist does an MRI, and the MRI shows 10 demyelinating areas in her brain, diagnoses her with MS. This is October 2024. November 2024, I was lecturing in that city, and that city's in another country. And she came, and she asked me, "Can you help me?" What am I going to say? "No? Go away?" Of course, I'm going to do my best to help you. "So, I'm not from this country or anything, but I'll do the best I can for you." So, did the mycotoxin test, she lit it up like a Christmas tree, treated her, eight months later, she's fine. She's normal again. October 2025. A year later, she gets a call from the neurologist's office saying, "It's time to repeat your MRI." She goes, has the MRI done. There's nothing. Neurologist is furious, calls the MRI place, said "You made a mistake. It's the wrong film. You gave me the wrong blah blah blah." No, it's the right one. He couldn't understand, and she said, "Here, call him. Write him. Send him an email." He didn't. He refused. So, anyway.

Rob Lutz 33:40
So was that the detox protocol that we've talked about before?

Andrew Campbell 34:04
Exactly.

Rob Lutz 34:05
Sounds right. Yep. So, I'll definitely include a link to that for listeners that want to go a little deeper on what to do.

Andrew Campbell 34:11
And the same with Alzheimer. This is a dentist, in Panama, where the canal is, not Florida. Okay, he's a dentist. He calls me--uh, he writes to me in a letter that he posts. He says--sends me pictures of his wife. She has Alzheimer. "She occasionally recognizes me. She does not recognize her two daughters or her grandchildren. Can you help?" So, I went about everything. Sure enough, Panama is a very hot and humid place. It's got this tropical weather, all that, and they lived in the same house for like 30 to 35 years. Things are going to happen. So, they had the house checked and redone. Yeah. There were several areas, because in the past they didn't have central air conditioning. They had window units, all that kind of business. Regardless, the point is they got rid of the source. I started treating her. Eight months later, she's flying up to the states to see her grandchildren.

Rob Lutz 35:26
Awesome.

Andrew Campbell 35:27
No, it makes sense. Find the cause. Remove the cause. Repair the damage. It's what the mechanic does with your car.

Rob Lutz 35:38
Exactly.

Andrew Campbell 35:39
It's that simple. It's not a big, complex, I don't know what, years of this, that, and the other. No, it's pretty straightforward.

Rob Lutz 35:47
Mm hm. It's scary, because they're so small and they're probably everywhere, but it sounds like it's something you can figure out the source and get rid of that. And you can also determine if you have mycotoxins, and then treat those.

Andrew Campbell 36:01
So, here's what a mom wrote me, and this is very compelling. "I went from being a national champion collegiate gymnast to sick for 12 years, unable to walk without assistance, see out of one eye, or care for my own three young boys without help. I saw over 30 doctors, spent hundreds of thousands of dollars, did the Shoemaker protocol twice, and lost our home and all of our belongings. I still did not get well until I found your webinars five years later. After I simply did the supplements you recommended, the six months of itraconazole, I got well faster than I ever thought possible. I am forever grateful and still a little shocked. So, thank you for giving me my life and my children's mom back." Again, it's--some people are in shock because it didn't take a lot of money and a lot of I don't know what.

Rob Lutz 36:02
Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah. This is really compelling. It's, uh.

Andrew Campbell 36:02
She's a healthcare practitioner.

Rob Lutz 36:02
Well, we've got to spread the word.

Andrew Campbell 36:02
Well, you're amazingly good at that.

Rob Lutz 36:02
Thank you. You know, we've covered a lot here. I'm, you know, definitely follow the the direction that you've taken us here. Is there anything else that you want to add, or any other takeaways, little pearls you want to share with the other docs who are listening?

Andrew Campbell 36:22
So, this is a study published in the journal Toxins. What they did, this group of doctors, is they took 44 patients with Parkinson's and 24 patients with Alzheimer, tested them and their caretaker wife or husband, who was fine, did blood tests, because obviously the one that were fine were the controls, and the Alzheimer or Parkinson were the sick ones, and they compared the two groups. And then they found that the group with Alzheimer or Parkinson had three specific mycotoxins: deoxynivalenol, sterigmatocystin, and ochratoxin. Treated them, and they got well. Guess what treatment? What we've talked about.

Rob Lutz 38:24
Yeah. with the protocol.

Andrew Campbell 38:26
Yeah. So, this was published four years ago.

Rob Lutz 38:31
So. the different mycotoxins, do you--is the treatment different or it's still basically the same protocol, regardless of which mycotoxins it might be?

Andrew Campbell 38:41
It's the same basic protocol. It's all the same base. You get rid--you've got to kill the source of the mycotoxin, which is the spore. Kill the source. You've got then to repair the damage. That takes about, more or less, six months, Bell curve, of course. Some shorter, some longer.

Rob Lutz 39:00
Yeah. So even though the molecule, the specific mycotoxin, might be different, the approach and the protocol and what you do is really the same.

Andrew Campbell 39:09
Correct.

Rob Lutz 39:10
Yeah.

Andrew Campbell 39:10
And if you look at toxicology, it's basically all the same, similar too. Yeah. Like for instance, heavy metals, you use chelation, but first it's, "Don't get around the stuff anymore."

Rob Lutz 39:24
Right,

Andrew Campbell 39:25
Repair the damage and chelate the stuff out of the body.

Rob Lutz 39:29
Mm hm. Same thing we were just talking with mycotoxins.

Andrew Campbell 39:33
Toxins. These are all toxins.

Rob Lutz 39:34
Yeah. Well, again, we'll, I'll link to, you know, some of the materials that we've talked about, definitely to the protocol. I think that'll be really interesting for folks that have been listening in here. And then I'll select a few articles out of that resource center that I think kind of tie this all together. So, anyone who's listening here and wants to go deeper, you can do that on Today's Practitioner, but I'll include links to specific resources that we have, that Dr. Campbell has provided, and so, you can really dig into that. And I'll include your contact information as well.

Andrew Campbell 40:08
I don't know if this is helpful for you or not, but I take pictures, and I take before and after pictures. I mentioned the lady who had dementia, the dentist's wife. His hobby is photography, so he took a picture of his wife before and eight months after. And he said, "My wife told me not to black out the eyes, because she wanted everybody to see that in one picture she has no life, and then the other she has her life back again." I did the same with MS patients, patients with all kinds of disorders, twin little boys who are autistic. Dad's an architect. Mom works at a bank. Grandma is taking care of them, and then when they hit age five, she says, "I can't anymore. You know, they were smaller before, but now they're too big for me to try to control them," et cetera. I saw them, and this is the neat part: I have a picture of them at the end of their first year of school, first grade, where they won an award for being a good student.

Rob Lutz 41:18
That's great.

Andrew Campbell 41:19
And then at age 17, they invited me to lunch. And the purpose was to celebrate that they had been accepted into engineering school.

Rob Lutz 41:32
Wow, that's amazing. That must just feel so good, such a rewarding experience to have as a practitioner to really make a difference.

Andrew Campbell 41:40
Yeah. And this is why I publish all these things, so other docs can read it. It's nuts. And none of this is my invention or develop--I didn't develop any of this.

Rob Lutz 41:51
Yeah.

Andrew Campbell 41:51
I got it all from reading.

Rob Lutz 41:53
Yeah, you just pulled it together so people--it makes it easier for them. They don't have to spend hours and days and, yeah.

Andrew Campbell 42:00
Doctors today have to do so many things for insurance companies, you know, fill in--every little dot has to be, all the details, because it's all computerized, and it's rejected if you haven't put everything on there and all this stuff. They don't have time to read anymore.

Rob Lutz 42:14
Yeah. Wow.

Andrew Campbell 42:16
So I read it for them.

Rob Lutz 42:18
And then you share. I love it. Well, this was great, Doctor Campbell. Thank you again for being on the show.

Andrew Campbell 42:25
You're welcome. Thank you for having me.

Rob Lutz 42:26
And I hope to have you back again. These are always really excellent conversations, and I appreciate you being on the show. Thank you so much.

Andrew Campbell 42:27
Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Take care. Bye bye now.

Rob Lutz 42:39
Thanks for listening to the OneMedicine Podcast. I hope you found today's episode interesting and came away with a few insights you can apply to your practice. If you're looking for the show notes, they can be found in the link below. If you want to go deeper on this topic or anything else, please visit todayspractitioner.com and consider registering for our weekly newsletter as well. Thanks again, and I hope you'll join us next time.